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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Dear Pam,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Thank you for the good news.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">We are very grateful for the constructive discussion on the list and the resulting significant improvement of the license.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Best regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Andreas<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Von:</b> License-review <license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Pamela Chestek<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Samstag, 18. März 2023 15:04<br>
<b>An:</b> license-review@lists.opensource.org<br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.3 (was v1.2)<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">The Board of the Open Source Initiative approved the Open Logistics License version 1.3 as an Open Source Initiative Certified license in the special purpose category of licenses at its March 19, 2023 meeting.<br>
<br>
The Board did so with the comment that it does not believe that choice of law provisions are necessary or advisable in open source licenses.<br>
<br>
Pamela S. Chestek<br>
Chair, License Committee<br>
Open Source Initiative<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 3/12/2023 8:31 PM, Pamela Chestek wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Attached is the recommendation of the License Committee to the Board of Directors of the OSI recommending approval of the Open Logistics License version 1.3<br>
<br>
This is only a recommendation; the next step is that the Board will vote on whether or not the licensed will be approved.<br>
<br>
Pamela S. Chestek<br>
Chair, License Committee<br>
Open Source Initiative<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 1/17/2023 8:41 AM, Andreas Nettsträter wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Dear all,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">attached you’ll find the updated version of our license.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">As discussed earlier, we’ve adapted the license name; we have corrected the parentheses in the first sentence of article 4 and we’ve deleted a paragraph from article 4. In our view,
paragraph 1 of article 4 already ensures the flow down of the licence and conditions, so that 4.4 is not necessarily needed. Therefore, we dropped it completely.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Andreas</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB">Von:</span></b><span lang="EN-GB"> License-review <</span><a href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB">>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Andreas Nettsträter<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag, 13. Januar 2023 14:28<br>
<b>An:</b> License submissions for OSI review <</span><a href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Dear Carlo, all,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">thanks for the advice. We already have some ideas to make it more understandable.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I’ll share an updated version (including some other discussed topics) of the license within the next days.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Andreas</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB">Von:</span></b><span lang="EN-GB"> License-review <</span><a href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB">>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Carlo Piana<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Samstag, 31. Dezember 2022 11:27<br>
<b>An:</b> License submissions for OSI review <</span><a href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Andreas,
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">definitely not authoritative, but since I am the one who raised the subject, I feel an obligation to provide a potential solution.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">I would not depart from the common practice of requesting that the recipients of distributed software be notified of the legal language in some form,
by including the whole text of the license along the distribution, or by making reference to a canonical online resource, and by requesting an appropriate legal notice. There are plenty of examples out there, all remixing the same concepts and language.
</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">See e.g. the GNU *GPLv3.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">All the best,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Carlo</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">
<hr size="2" width="100%" align="center">
</span></div>
<div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Da:
</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">"Andreas Nettsträter" <</span><a href="mailto:andreas.nettstraeter@openlogisticsfoundation.org"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">andreas.nettstraeter@openlogisticsfoundation.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">><br>
<b>A: </b>"License submissions for OSI review" <</span><a href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">><br>
<b>Inviato: </b>Venerdì, 23 dicembre 2022 15:01:24<br>
<b>Oggetto: </b>Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Dear Pam, dear Carlo,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">the last bulletpoint of Article 4 was meant to implement an obligation to flow down the obligations of the other bulletpoints of Article 4; if the provision requires modification to make this clear,
we can make the respective amendments.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">How could we formulate it in a better way?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Andreas</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">Von:</span></b><span style="color:black"> License-review <</span><a href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</a><span style="color:black">>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Pamela Chestek<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Mittwoch, 14. </span><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Dezember 2022 18:05<br>
<b>An:</b> </span><a href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">On 12/14/2022 4:24 AM, Carlo Piana wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">On 12/5/2022 2:45 PM, Carlo Piana wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#007CFF">You must ensure that the recipients of the Subject Matter of the License or</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#007CFF">Derivative Works are obligated to incorporate the provisions of this Section 4</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#007CFF">into any license under which they distribute the Subject Matter of the License</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#007CFF">or Derivative Works to any other recipients.</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#007CFF"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
</blockquote>
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">This provision requires the "You" to a legal effect. As a general remark, this is an open ended obligation and IMVHO a bad design decision, since the legal effect depends on many different circumstances outside the control of the "You", including intent, capacity, errors, lack of proper form etc. You can surely include perform an obligation as a condition of the grant, but including a legal effect is to me really really seeking for trouble.</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Carlo, I'm not following what you're saying. Are you saying that the Licensor has some liability if the user doesn't actually incorporate the provisions
of Section 4 into their downstream license?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Sorry Pam, I have written poorly</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">I meant "This provision requires the "You" to **achieve** a legal effect." The obligation requires that *the recipients** be "obligated". Here it is more of a guarantee, something that you are liable
for and not necessarily control, so the risk is on you whatever it happens.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Thanks, that's very helpful.<br>
<br>
Pam<br>
<br>
Pamela S. Chestek<br>
Chestek Legal<br>
PO Box 2492<br>
Raleigh, NC 27602<br>
</span><a href="mailto:pamela@chesteklegal.com" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-GB">pamela@chesteklegal.com</span></a><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"><br>
(919) 800-8033<br>
</span><a href="https://deu01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chesteklegal.com%2F&data=05%7C01%7Candreas.nettstraeter%40openlogisticsfoundation.org%7C7415f4cc400e45ffed8108db27b9dc2f%7Cb346d634acfb42c7bd44f1557ee89b1b%7C1%7C0%7C638147451442332935%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=qfKBJlTgNjyOmTtFhelrtXHppNozjeAmLX5VixIXO94%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-GB">www.chesteklegal.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
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<pre>The opinions expressed in this email are those of the sender and not necessarily those of the Open Source Initiative. Communication from the Open Source Initiative will be sent from an opensource.org email address.<o:p></o:p></pre>
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<pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>The opinions expressed in this email are those of the sender and not necessarily those of the Open Source Initiative. Communication from the Open Source Initiative will be sent from an opensource.org email address.<o:p></o:p></pre>
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