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Hi Andreas,<br>
<br>
We will consider version 1.2 withdrawn and this a resubmission. The
Decision Date for it will be 30 days after submission, that is, 30
days after January 17, 2023.[^1]<br>
<br>
Pamela Chestek<br>
Chair, License Committee<br>
Open Source Initiative<br>
<br>
[^1]: "'Decision Date' for a license normally means (a) 60 days
after a license is initially submitted to the license-review list
for review, and (b) 30 days after submission of a revised version of
a license that was previously submitted for review."
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://opensource.org/approval">https://opensource.org/approval</a><br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/17/2023 8:41 AM, Andreas
Nettsträter wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:FRYP281MB023744FFB8CC776702D991179BC69@FRYP281MB0237.DEUP281.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">Dear all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">attached you’ll find the updated version of our
license.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">As discussed earlier, we’ve adapted the license
name; we have corrected the parentheses in the first
sentence of article 4 and we’ve deleted a paragraph from
article 4. In our view, paragraph 1 of article 4 already
ensures the flow down of the licence and conditions, so that
4.4 is not necessarily needed. Therefore, we dropped it
completely.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">Andreas<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB">Von:</span></b><span
lang="EN-GB"> License-review <</span><a
href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB">>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Andreas Nettsträter<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag, 13. Januar 2023 14:28<br>
<b>An:</b> License submissions for OSI review <</span><a
href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open
Logistics License v1.2<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">Dear Carlo, all,</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">thanks for the advice. We already have some
ideas to make it more understandable.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">I’ll share an updated version (including some
other discussed topics) of the license within the next days.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB">Andreas</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB">Von:</span></b><span
lang="EN-GB"> License-review <</span><a
href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB">>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Carlo Piana<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Samstag, 31. Dezember 2022 11:27<br>
<b>An:</b> License submissions for OSI review <</span><a
href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open
Logistics License v1.2<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">Andreas,
</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">definitely not authoritative, but since I
am the one who raised the subject, I feel an obligation
to provide a potential solution.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">I would not depart from the common practice
of requesting that the recipients of distributed
software be notified of the legal language in some form,
by including the whole text of the license along the
distribution, or by making reference to a canonical
online resource, and by requesting an appropriate legal
notice. There are plenty of examples out there, all
remixing the same concepts and language.
</span><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">See
e.g. the GNU *GPLv3.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">All
the best,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Carlo</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"
align="center"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">
<hr width="100%" size="2" align="center">
</span></div>
<div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF
1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">Da:
</span></b><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">"Andreas Nettsträter" <</span><a
href="mailto:andreas.nettstraeter@openlogisticsfoundation.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"
lang="EN-GB">andreas.nettstraeter@openlogisticsfoundation.org</span></a><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>A: </b>"License submissions for OSI review" <</span><a
href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"
lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">><br>
<b>Inviato: </b>Venerdì, 23 dicembre 2022 15:01:24<br>
<b>Oggetto: </b>Re: [License-review] For Approval:
Open Logistics License v1.2</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF
1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">Dear Pam, dear Carlo,</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">the last bulletpoint of Article 4 was
meant to implement an obligation to flow down the
obligations of the other bulletpoints of Article 4; if
the provision requires modification to make this
clear, we can make the respective amendments.</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">How could we formulate it in a better
way?</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Andreas</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">Von:</span></b><span
style="color:black"> License-review <</span><a
href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</a><span
style="color:black">>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Pamela Chestek<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Mittwoch, 14. </span><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-GB">Dezember 2022
18:05<br>
<b>An:</b> </span><a
href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-GB">license-review@lists.opensource.org</span></a><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval:
Open Logistics License v1.2</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">On 12/14/2022 4:24 AM, Carlo Piana
wrote:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF
1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">On 12/5/2022 2:45 PM, Carlo Piana
wrote:</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF" lang="EN-GB">You must ensure that the recipients of the Subject Matter of the License or</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF" lang="EN-GB">Derivative Works are obligated to incorporate the provisions of this Section 4</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF" lang="EN-GB">into any license under which they distribute the Subject Matter of the License</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF" lang="EN-GB">or Derivative Works to any other recipients.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
</blockquote>
<pre><span style="color:black" lang="EN-GB">This provision requires the "You" to a legal effect. As a general remark, this is an open ended obligation and IMVHO a bad design decision, since the legal effect depends on many different circumstances outside the control of the "You", including intent, capacity, errors, lack of proper form etc. You can surely include perform an obligation as a condition of the grant, but including a legal effect is to me really really seeking for trouble.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB">Carlo, I'm not following what
you're saying. Are you saying that the Licensor
has some liability if the user doesn't actually
incorporate the provisions of Section 4 into
their downstream license?</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">Sorry Pam, I have written poorly</span><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">I meant "This provision requires the
"You" to **achieve** a legal effect." The
obligation requires that *the recipients** be
"obligated". Here it is more of a guarantee,
something that you are liable for and not
necessarily control, so the risk is on you
whatever it happens.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB"> </span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"
lang="EN-GB">Thanks, that's very helpful.<br>
<br>
Pam<br>
<br>
Pamela S. Chestek<br>
Chestek Legal<br>
PO Box 2492<br>
Raleigh, NC 27602<br>
</span><a href="mailto:pamela@chesteklegal.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
lang="EN-GB">pamela@chesteklegal.com</span></a><span
style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"><br>
(919) 800-8033<br>
</span><a
href="https://deu01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chesteklegal.com%2F&data=05%7C01%7Candreas.nettstraeter%40openlogisticsfoundation.org%7C557638f3b6bb4821200b08daf56a2618%7Cb346d634acfb42c7bd44f1557ee89b1b%7C1%7C0%7C638092133503191856%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Hnjr4Yeng9ad2B0bSZicC2uUbgrgRvn%2FWps0AKkwlIQ%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
lang="EN-GB">www.chesteklegal.com</span></a><span
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"
lang="EN-GB"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
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