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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Dear Carlo, all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">thanks for the advice. We already have some ideas to make it more understandable.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I’ll share an updated version (including some other discussed topics) of the license within the next days.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Andreas<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Von:</b> License-review <license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Carlo Piana<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Samstag, 31. Dezember 2022 11:27<br>
<b>An:</b> License submissions for OSI review <license-review@lists.opensource.org><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Andreas,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">definitely not authoritative, but since I am the one who raised the subject, I feel an obligation to provide a potential solution.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">I would not depart from the common practice of requesting that the recipients of distributed software be notified of the legal language in some form, by including
the whole text of the license along the distribution, or by making reference to a canonical online resource, and by requesting an appropriate legal notice. There are plenty of examples out there, all remixing the same concepts and language. See e.g. the GNU
*GPLv3.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">All the best,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Carlo<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Da:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">"Andreas Nettsträter" <<a href="mailto:andreas.nettstraeter@openlogisticsfoundation.org">andreas.nettstraeter@openlogisticsfoundation.org</a>><br>
<b>A: </b>"License submissions for OSI review" <<a href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org">license-review@lists.opensource.org</a>><br>
<b>Inviato: </b>Venerdì, 23 dicembre 2022 15:01:24<br>
<b>Oggetto: </b>Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Dear Pam, dear Carlo,</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">the last bulletpoint of Article 4 was meant to implement an obligation to flow down the obligations of the other bulletpoints of Article 4; if the provision requires modification to make this clear,
we can make the respective amendments.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">How could we formulate it in a better way?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Regards</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:black">Andreas</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">Von:</span></b><span style="color:black"> License-review <<a href="mailto:license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org">license-review-bounces@lists.opensource.org</a>>
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Pamela Chestek<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Mittwoch, 14. Dezember 2022 18:05<br>
<b>An:</b> <a href="mailto:license-review@lists.opensource.org">license-review@lists.opensource.org</a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [License-review] For Approval: Open Logistics License v1.2<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">On 12/14/2022 4:24 AM, Carlo Piana wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">On 12/5/2022 2:45 PM, Carlo Piana wrote:</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<pre><span style="color:#007CFF">You must ensure that the recipients of the Subject Matter of the License or</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF">Derivative Works are obligated to incorporate the provisions of this Section 4</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF">into any license under which they distribute the Subject Matter of the License</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF">or Derivative Works to any other recipients.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:#007CFF"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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<pre><span style="color:black">This provision requires the "You" to a legal effect. As a general remark, this is an open ended obligation and IMVHO a bad design decision, since the legal effect depends on many different circumstances outside the control of the "You", including intent, capacity, errors, lack of proper form etc. You can surely include perform an obligation as a condition of the grant, but including a legal effect is to me really really seeking for trouble.<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">Carlo, I'm not following what you're saying. Are you saying that the Licensor has some liability if the user doesn't actually incorporate the provisions of Section
4 into their downstream license?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Sorry Pam, I have written poorly<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">I meant "This provision requires the "You" to **achieve** a legal effect." The obligation requires that *the recipients** be "obligated". Here it is more of a guarantee, something that you are liable for and not
necessarily control, so the risk is on you whatever it happens.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Thanks, that's very helpful.<br>
<br>
Pam<br>
<br>
Pamela S. Chestek<br>
Chestek Legal<br>
PO Box 2492<br>
Raleigh, NC 27602<br>
<a href="mailto:pamela@chesteklegal.com" target="_blank">pamela@chesteklegal.com</a><br>
(919) 800-8033<br>
<a href="https://deu01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chesteklegal.com%2F&data=05%7C01%7Candreas.nettstraeter%40openlogisticsfoundation.org%7C81bdc2949b4444a1cabb08daeb19b591%7Cb346d634acfb42c7bd44f1557ee89b1b%7C1%7C0%7C638080792920404123%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Gh6zsHhEJzqk%2FVUa3%2FG7Rkpxa5OpSqsQVBItNQOKRTA%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank">www.chesteklegal.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black"><br>
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